Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.21]) by h1439878.stratoserver.net (8.14.2/8.14.2/Debian-2build1) with ESMTP id s128OiYA024447 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:24:45 +0100 Received: from relay2.uni-heidelberg.de ([129.206.210.211]) by mx-ha.gmx.net (mxgmx109) with ESMTPS (Nemesis) id 0MgYnL-1VvOXh0xUd-00O2TM for ; Sun, 02 Feb 2014 09:24:38 +0100 Received: from listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (listserv.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.100.94]) by relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id s128M0Hr029846 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:22:00 +0100 Received: from listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (listserv.uni-heidelberg.de [127.0.0.1]) by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id s126u9hI006427; Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:21:59 +0100 Received: by LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 16.0) with spool id 10685551 for LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:21:59 +0100 Received: from relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (relay2.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.210.211]) by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id s128LxI3009858 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:21:59 +0100 Received: from msg.wmi.amu.edu.pl (msg.wmi.amu.edu.pl [150.254.78.50]) by relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id s128LmT2029793 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:21:51 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by msg.wmi.amu.edu.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABF52669F2 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:21:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from msg.wmi.amu.edu.pl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (msg.wmi.amu.edu.pl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mltnICED8f6D for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:21:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from aga-netbook (101-138.echostar.pl [213.156.101.138]) by msg.wmi.amu.edu.pl (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 827DE669EA for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:21:48 +0100 (CET) References: <52E8E264.4010800@gmail.com> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.8.1 (GTK+ 2.24.17; i686-pc-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de id s128LxI3009859 Message-ID: <20140202092147.56667308@aga-netbook> Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2014 09:21:47 +0100 Reply-To: Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project Sender: Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project From: Marcin Borkowski Organization: WMI UAM Subject: Re: Feasibility of GUIs for authors and class designers in LaTeX3 To: LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE In-Reply-To: Precedence: list List-Help: , List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Owner: List-Archive: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by relay2.uni-heidelberg.de id s128M0Hr029846 Envelope-To: X-GMX-Antispam: 0 (Mail was not recognized as spam); Detail=V3; X-GMX-Antivirus: 0 (no virus found) X-UI-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:cMS9hLra2Pg=:KnKFM/M4tHDhVMdIT1KyorJmGX bjIU25kA2YUptUftSqVNJPtTT0iN4c7yEvXtnEl84mmNbc2xIood6KmxiWo1s5ZQSQfdHYvs6 X2BtqhpKls/ek781yDoOUGjuFA9/RU9VXsVKpk9w27nnaIuOA/4zQztqK3FLa05qlGMmXY8WB lKLxUOUj+sc+IFznRvrd0wWJG2LDO6EHnm9Dvpsvus6gZ/Xo80sgaFqdfiAvqLjfTNMTQNT+w AEYMlFvgmXHuvnRL5JlN9LvOQHYIcjBXPdB8OxFaeip8+MwTedqJRGe0FTEMKidoZ6WhHH1ob IFVPb8vUdu9X0J1nhuyJTh3cHmtsQ8PQB2ZARZRVIJAMSdf134DY/klyc8oUq8NeU82uomZd0 ReNPDhNqU0ZyNONUg/zB/AE5jAe6TaKMXamM241B3HpeFsSHr9I8tmjRJ0HzTfjc7zzcLpmxW 246rBoYUv7kIP4Q8/GrdF9E3yGiXPDLokDy6+2R5SN0z8x2OUF/7af2dWyhi6TCZko9Gq8mVZ CGN2exMPSTOOt22YGyjCnpJOKecmVEnldKlWiLjSSRasSrCJ1zSvJfM7Lr9RRQgqyqAwSBe3J /wsAGTRdo1rzdYd+ukPRcMcuc285htwt411xHsdDf6E5WH0t7XdFa5PoNAedDcPoWePtspaFr Gh9YNyBHTAOJ4/veknlr6wWUG75t8A+mALVAib6rrXaacclW9Hs3KtzMazw9IpDrO9dNE+aSW 5cysKwzsyFltcx2aL/r+01YQqEe0tg4lKiHQQLfLq5bq9BVmENPxOH8daUKwRzi+FGjuwthLF Tna41uKxfLwIdZQEFUpO9064GrV60bBPFhSxGsCIAKdAsRdHQ1CaRsa/QsO87cfPyEastdMqX TeNzgyjnKvm1I7embTien8Btt3S+ucaWn33thMUZj4T7YVK8yRbCAcMiWb1LNrZnlxuqA7KTE baN2yjsCSliYwd19Xzb/SiCGpvRYvqzF/oLgr3e12PtXCkORxBqBgc51SqNc3tysAggu6i2DA 6ljjrzWDUPvw4EOMaaRb9HdB8XHLgTDydONu6zBxwbqYpsJJAS1n5V8OM0JBdKMgb7s4aeQCm 08jRPDEF7q/WLWp0wX/QzP0WS74IioN8Y9hE+Fi52pHG6lInmQliZavwIXh6K3iSyRvB/lS4h 0D9xXvd7ZnN4YolZUsw96iTLVEl0BnGXyHAk6RzrO2pJEoYULY71B1nH6tZNEhmu1cKvGv5KC CFbXr2ecS+5p55i+8wtif9aUhbutAdUjetC+YcqG1fesyqyeI111kA0YkzXAPe5BUtAmVyTSi Io0yRrdALaFfcVhzNKwxnJJV08BePMIQ0eqbhbA26tLBTpb2E3zsCSn+OT9iaudpJHyOHrziO OHFs6qxViKIALSsodRaVuzZGoFASMxYYP2twwAlwbpKhLLS5CWbW0/38hus X-UI-Loop:V01:x6cQqSJp9VM=:8pKxJw/x4TOqyx3mcu6GR4vjhYDhKojhDLU9p9qTQqM= Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 7323 Dnia 2014-02-01, o godz. 18:32:26 William F Hammond napisa=C5=82(a): > There are two long-standing questions underlying this discussion. >=20 > 1. Can present LaTeX users learn to write well-structured user-level > LaTeX? No. I am (unfortunately) rather a pessimist here. I work for a journal, and I'm (among others) responsible for typesetting. Also, I'm sometimes perceived as a "local TeX guru" at my faculty (though by no means am I the only or best expert in LaTeX), so I see people's LaTeX code. What do I see, and repeatedly? {\bf whatever} instead of \textbf{...} \begin{enumerate} \item[a)] ... \item[b)] ... \end{enumerate} Bibliography rendered as \begin{enumerate} \item[[1]] ... \item[[2]] ... \end{enumerate} (yes, it doesn't exactly work, but who cares?) $^{\small 2}$\footnotetext[2]{My cool footnote} (No, I'm not making this up! Note also that this gives a warning nobody ever cares to read, not to mention understand. It works, right?) \section*{{\centering\bf 2. MY COOL SECTION\par} This is the end of the previous paragraph...\\ \indent And this is the beginning of the next one. ...which leads to the following\\ \vspace{0.4cm} \noindent\textbf{Definition.} ... The following formula holds for all x $>$ 0... and many, many things like these. A friend of mine, asked "what to do so that people stop writing bad LaTeX (user-level) code", gave me a brilliant answer. After each stupid coding practice, cut them off one finger. After committing ten idiotic mistakes, they'll stop writing bad LaTeX. Best, --=20 Marcin Borkowski http://octd.wmi.amu.edu.pl/en/Marcin_Borkowski Adam Mickiewicz University