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[217.44.16.186]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id w4sm14632289wia.9.2013.07.18.01.02.53 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Thu, 18 Jul 2013 01:02:54 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.8; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130620 Thunderbird/17.0.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <51C94FA0.1080803@morningstar2.co.uk> <51DD0EBD.6080308@morningstar2.co.uk> <51DF2000.30703@morningstar2.co.uk> <51E12031.4060600@morningstar2.co.uk> <51E2FFC0.6010209@morningstar2.co.uk> <51E5AD8C.1020405@morningstar2.co.uk> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.5.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <51E7A12D.7040700@morningstar2.co.uk> Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2013 09:02:53 +0100 Reply-To: Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project Sender: Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project From: Joseph Wright Subject: Re: Time for \UseExplPackage? (Was re: l3keys feature request) To: LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE In-Reply-To: Precedence: list List-Help: , List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Owner: List-Archive: Envelope-To: X-GMX-Antispam: 0 (Mail was not recognized as spam); Detail=V3; X-GMX-Antivirus: 0 (no virus found) X-UI-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:gD6sk11oeZM=:yDvUTu3vrcCFs9qR4vhkUSeThv 17yQvjdxhMn45JWKErgbzPil+AtXt8yOxMAzh3cNOPnxYsmMFvo/tZb8ZK60yOov1giVJKpSd wVmp+Yrm8qSzDM+RGzIl3zR0DbsCqn3tTAIxUwN901Mtm4J+QK6g4bC1DEUp5uAXkolm7eo4Z DM8HyDmvj2qvfN7iaJND+fjSpppjm5BnnIVLwPkdmBAtNKX3Dx3aS+g3hy6XXKhB1rGpBYOUn nMAh5Xdl1Kv3axtKl9AAGU3HNi8k9Iw/kWmey5BDHlzIr75pPn4yFEHrtiGdl8xsXh6Pe8HRD mczrKLm1rZvWywhkB9SfSDQPnvAk3iyMV6MQbdkYjMXASRsbH3Vzp8o4pEHFbHt/QuUP2/GDl bX4yd+NOekI36661EhDJB3Rj00wvLVn00n9QMB5lPtAJ8MWLhW+XaOARs8I7tOhL8/0gwGL4c PDmHeSWztJ44KCQ9YAWNiB5MfeoBsvvAKBjVp2mfW1Co4l83rFgtvnWv4axmFSd2giD4lfLB1 BUIOTdw4+s9lE7cHlY3rMEE5oPq7ppEGPuJxTR6ARc2UO+vBG8JqhBsW16lwls6qf4oTzP8gv 98e0DO2HB+rxRrWyXQMZRtQw2IRRHIC7gnUU72n/zP/xOcTv6QDKZenn9C0W3g7J7BlAGCpSK 3SD9PRKm/ZBQdrw5Q/lf9HMG/7tsDFV+j77M9EQdvbebTX27CDq5Ix7oLbxvBGz6jGoJkWN9X bRmC9i8cC2hpN7mRCJnVwQ2mdR3KCuySIJ5FGUELrpcms87vzim31TXD1613IU2ExEbxUR25x Q04aFuPTdN9b7Bo9XAsF08uuFTidP3mtOJaODr3AbtGOnmCx1oaLk6xwDJR7CGcyfQ7WmyVdq WxxKSPe3yISPf2qBu/wD8tf+cw4y6EDo7ou4Up6II2NLvG8C2nOH7eb52P22n6TeqQCxerAVS X3bgJhrTfB+hF7ja5bnwsZt7Lsw43eofh8gKUNNrXBvOJNKxQH3UQeMI15NFwKAyI4GSAAegv srwPXXBPXAX2qFZrc1ZxW450Kpcb0T+r3oJDDSTrelQhhLPnbqa2wO0bBIvBOUbvIetH1OKm+ 3pVvXwbpSRlhNDI+iH3WaFoXEc56il8rHSCPEHsxF0mKscHt9O1LHQ+hPjndGGJwQxxQB4tx6 tPudjRP4uWSDfWJcQk5S2edoxkzQYTZkAVAoW99dEeAJ+cKij52hnO0+EiI4t+JWQaTfYgIV9 Xa1923/+QGTT3tiWMcOFaCxv+2WxjtsDJldrHBOXm0vZhqr1k9q73cgESwvfcaUnl2fNLjw4E Y4SYjlpiJsPJ+Nfpkjx81Up9SAR2IYTiXgqbAeV0qGDBIvq9IZ/YJwrsB1BVMsUk7F34XcIhb iYtJMKDu+p274zxdMBurgWBjeu5s0FLVX9vZMyh2DCl+q3YnRiVcuW3iTm6dYA6zORd9QVSA4 W8t/4Y2QAMMP7ISLpaFqQ4fhZE/oT371080QQ4EndlRLWx/O93B/JOlv407YFxBvMezhKCXz9 mnIV3avYnC4OHEQAHDZHjTFc7ilEHoIYTYYEpy1WKNd2yEPZfO/r1l5EzJvz3TjrY66AIzl83 tyDZZ62alXjRsd8+i2/EtargjV26PX4q X-UI-Loop:V01:IxgbJoWAqIY=:gSFpcZzclZYHkKzgDDptqAYCzK1YB8NO+rXnuvxymeU= Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 7260 On 17/07/2013 19:27, Joel C. Salomon wrote: > Joseph Wright writes: >> At present I'm waiting to see what people thing of the code-level stuff. >> At the same time, I'm not sure about making package option processing >> too complex. The lesson I've learned is that keyval in options is >> governed by the LaTeX2e kernel: options are expanded, and checking for >> clashes doesn't 'know' about keyval. Thus I tend to think load-time >> options should really be limited to things that need to happen there, >> with later \setup to cover more complex option sets. > > Is the behavior of package & class options expected to be different > (specifically, keyval-aware) in a LaTeX3 kernel? If so, would it be > appropriate to define \UseExplPackage et al. so that the future behavior can > be experimented with? > > --Joel Not really worthwhile. The way that the LaTeX2e kernel does option processing means that expansion/space stripping happens 'early'. As such, you can't alter it in a way that is easy. Look at the option keyval-patching code in xkeyval and kvoptions to see this: you have to pre-load an additional package before the one where you want 'new' effects. Until we actually have the basics of a new format, this isn't going to help. -- Joseph Wright