Received: from mail.proteosys.com ([213.139.130.197]) by nummer-3.proteosys with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:05:25 +0100 Received: by mail.proteosys.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n03H5N1e026265 for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:05:23 +0100 Received: from listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (listserv.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.100.94]) by relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n03H1f8b013758 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:01:42 +0100 Received: from listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id n02N1E9A027281; Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:01:38 +0100 Received: by LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 15.5) with spool id 174040 for LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:01:38 +0100 Received: from relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (relay2.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.210.211]) by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id n03H1cIZ017865 for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:01:38 +0100 Received: from mta2.cl.cam.ac.uk (mta2.cl.cam.ac.uk [128.232.0.14]) by relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n03H1PY9013655 for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:01:29 +0100 Received: from mole.cl.cam.ac.uk ([128.232.8.151]) by mta2.cl.cam.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.092 #1) id 1LJ9sJ-0003DR-00 for LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Sat, 03 Jan 2009 17:01:23 +0000 Received: from mole.cl.cam.ac.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mole.cl.cam.ac.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CEFD4A171 for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2009 17:01:23 +0000 (GMT) X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.2; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de id n03H1cIZ017866 Message-ID: <19914.1231002082@mole.cl.cam.ac.uk> Date: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 17:01:22 +0000 Reply-To: Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project Sender: Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project From: Robin Fairbairns Subject: Re: \begin{} ... \end{} To: LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 03 Jan 2009 17:44:41 +0100. <495F95F9.5060801@gmx.de> Precedence: list List-Help: , List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Owner: List-Archive: X-ProteoSys-SPAM-Score: -2.599 () BAYES_00 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.64 on 213.139.130.197 Return-Path: owner-latex-l@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Jan 2009 17:05:25.0249 (UTC) FILETIME=[7862B710:01C96DC5] Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 5571 Arno Trautmann wrote: > Joseph Wright wrote: > My opinion about the \begin\...end: I don't like it at all. > ConTeXt uses \startenv ... \endenv, which is a bit better. A perfect thing > would be: \envstart ... \envend. Reason: autocompletion works much better. > Now I always have to type \begin{do to get \begin{document} as > completion. With \documentstart it would only be \do . you're talking about the user interface, which could very well be improved. (the current one isn't too bad for me, since i tend not ever to type environments: emacs/auctex does 'em for me.) joseph seemed to me to be addressing the internal macros that implement environments, rather than what the user says to invoke the environment. the existing system has its problems, not least because one mayn't use \newcommand to define a command \end...; this is certainly a bear trap. however, there seem relatively few bears around nowadays. we have had _one_ confused user on c.t.t in the last 12 months, that i recall. robin