Received: from mail.proteosys.com ([213.139.130.197]) by nummer-3.proteosys with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:17:00 +0200 Received: by mail.proteosys.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m8HGGskh021365 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:16:55 +0200 Received: from listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (listserv.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.100.94]) by relay.uni-heidelberg.de (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m8HGCkg2007657 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:12:46 +0200 Received: from listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id m8HE68DA010773; Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:12:43 +0200 Received: by LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 15.5) with spool id 41559 for LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:12:43 +0200 Received: from relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (relay2.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.210.211]) by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id m8HGChIp010647 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:12:43 +0200 Received: from mailgate5.uea.ac.uk (mailgate5.uea.ac.uk [139.222.130.185]) by relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m8HGCQg0002635 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:12:30 +0200 Received: from [139.222.128.187] (helo=ueams04.uea.ac.uk) by mailgate5.uea.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1Kfzdg-0004bQ-7A for LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:12:24 +0100 Received: from [139.222.200.93] by ueams04.uea.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Kfzdg-0006FY-4j for LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:12:24 +0100 User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.16 (Windows/20080708) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <48D0AF89.2010704@morningstar2.co.uk> <27990a880809170102x3a452c6elc237b94cf964687b@mail.gmail.com> <48D0FF21.8080101@morningstar2.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <48D12C65.2070908@morningstar2.co.uk> Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:12:21 +0100 Reply-To: Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project Sender: Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project From: Joseph Wright Subject: Re: Array and amstext To: LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE In-Reply-To: Precedence: list List-Help: , List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Owner: List-Archive: X-ProteoSys-SPAM-Score: -2.599 () BAYES_00 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.64 on 213.139.130.197 Return-Path: owner-latex-l@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Sep 2008 16:17:00.0501 (UTC) FILETIME=[D0685850:01C918E0] Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 5343 Will Robertson wrote: > I think for now assume that anything that's written with the expl3 > package(s) is to be used in a LaTeX2e environment. I guess I consider it > a bit like the etoolbox package: it provides package writers with better > tools to do their job. Worry about LaTeX3 when there's actual talk of > formats being built that drop LaTeX2e support. The difference (in the short term) is that etoolbox is "stable". So I can use that in production packages and not worry about the macros available altering in the future. Anything I write with expl3 is itself experimental as a result. [Of course, I note that etoolbox has had some renames going on. However, it is "released" and most of the changes were pretty soon after it came out. So the general point stands.] > (Err, agreed, everyone?) > > This way you can minimise the code you have to write (since whichever > LaTeX2e package provides it) and it will perhaps become clearer which > (currently external) packages do need to be pulled into the kernel. Here is the point, really. I can write what I like using expl3, but I can't release it as production. So everything has to be done twice, once in standard TeX/LaTeX and once in expl3 (if I want to do the later at all). That will change when the current l3 packages reach a point where I can rely on them not changing, where I can then write new stuff in l3 + support as needed from LaTeX2e packages, with the aim of minimising the later. (By the way, I can't see that any LaTeX3 kernel can possibly support 2e packages. Surely the entire thing will be structured so differently that writing the necessary hooks will be too much work.) -- Joseph Wright