Received: from mail.proteosys.com ([213.139.130.197]) by nummer-3.proteosys with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:13:31 +0200 Received: by mail.proteosys.com (8.12.10/8.12.2) with ESMTP id j2TLDTNi010145 for ; Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:13:29 +0200 Received: from listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (listserv.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.119.176]) by relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j2TL7CtL026331; Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:07:12 +0200 (MET DST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C534A4.28940F80" Received: from listserv (listserv.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.119.176]) by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (8.12.7/8.12.7/SuSE Linux 0.6) with ESMTP id j2SM0g8L029065; Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:05:03 +0200 Received: from LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE by LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 1.8e) with spool id 187405 for LATEX-L@LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:05:02 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Received: from relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (relay2.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.210.211]) by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de (8.12.7/8.12.7/SuSE Linux 0.6) with ESMTP id j2TL52Yd024151 for ; Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:05:02 +0200 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org (fencepost.gnu.org [199.232.76.164]) by relay2.uni-heidelberg.de (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j2TL6ktL026234 for ; Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:06:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lola.goethe.zz) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1DGNuC-0007nF-Qm for LATEX-L@listserv.uni-heidelberg.de; Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:05:45 -0500 In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20050329205524.024722b0@pop3.web.de> ( =?iso-8859-1?q?Uwe_L=FCck's_message_of?= "Tue, 29 Mar 2005 21:23:32 +0200") References: <5.1.0.14.0.20050329205524.024722b0@pop3.web.de> Return-Path: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Mar 2005 21:13:31.0846 (UTC) FILETIME=[29152660:01C534A4] User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.0.50 (gnu/linux) x-mime-autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by listserv.uni-heidelberg.de id j2TL52Yd024152 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang at proteosys.com X-ProteoSys-SPAM-Score: 0 () Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: Re: \@reinserts, \holdinginserts Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 22:05:45 +0100 Message-ID: A X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: \@reinserts, \holdinginserts Thread-Index: AcU0pClJO2Qe6ffURyibqT2mnH3ZNA== From: "David Kastrup" Sender: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" To: Reply-To: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 4847 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C534A4.28940F80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Uwe L=FCck writes: > 1. I have solved my practical problem. I still don't know > what exactly happened before -- I don't care. As a hint: > It has worked since I have run \outputpenalty=3D-10004 > with \holdinginserts>0 (I reported before that otherwise > the \footins box isn't empty with the ensuing > \outputenalty=3D-10002, in spite of \holdinginserts>0). > > 2. With simply switching \holdinginserts as sketched > before, you create another bug (well, wait:). \@specialoutput > measures the \footins box ..., so in adding floats it doesn't > take account of any footnotes after \holdinginserts>0. If you set \holdinginserts, of course you should not pass the page data on to the "real" output routine: it will wack up all its accounting. Special penalties are a problem. Strictly speaking, they need to get reinserted, then the whole list reprocessed without holdinginserts, the special routine called, and the holdinginserts reapplied. > I have made an example giving an awkward outcome > -- guess: a float that better should have waited for footnotes, > but one may wonder how real-life this is, I am preparing > something perhaps more digestible, may be for CTAN or > what someone suggests ... You must _only_ _ever_ use \holdinginserts with _identical_ page parameters, in particular the same \vsize as when doing the real run. If you don't, the decisions which inserts to float and which ones to split (and where) would differ. > however, this seems to favour what Frank Mittelbach (at least some > frank from latex-bugs...) expressed in latex/3370: the rewriting > will be done for LaTeX3, not 2e. Frank will be glad to hear that, I am sure. -- David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum ------_=_NextPart_001_01C534A4.28940F80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: \@reinserts, \holdinginserts

Uwe L=FCck <uwe.lueck@WEB.DE> writes:

> 1. I have solved my practical problem. I still = don't know
> what exactly happened before -- I don't care. As = a hint:
> It has worked since I have run = \outputpenalty=3D-10004
> with \holdinginserts>0 (I reported before = that otherwise
> the \footins box isn't empty with the = ensuing
> \outputenalty=3D-10002, in spite of = \holdinginserts>0).
>
> 2. With simply switching \holdinginserts as = sketched
> before, you create another bug (well, wait:). = \@specialoutput
> measures the \footins box ..., so in adding = floats it doesn't
> take account of any footnotes after = \holdinginserts>0.

If you set \holdinginserts, of course you should not = pass the page
data on to the "real" output routine: it = will wack up all its
accounting.  Special penalties are a = problem.  Strictly speaking, they
need to get reinserted, then the whole list = reprocessed without
holdinginserts, the special routine called, and the = holdinginserts
reapplied.

> I have made an example giving an awkward = outcome
> -- guess: a float that better should have waited = for footnotes,
> but one may wonder how real-life this is, I am = preparing
> something perhaps more digestible, may be for = CTAN or
> what someone suggests ...

You must _only_ _ever_ use \holdinginserts with = _identical_ page
parameters, in particular the same \vsize as when = doing the real run.
If you don't, the decisions which inserts to float = and which ones to
split (and where) would differ.

> however, this seems to favour what Frank = Mittelbach (at least some
> frank from latex-bugs...)  expressed in = latex/3370: the rewriting
> will be done for LaTeX3, not 2e.

Frank will be glad to hear that, I am sure.

--
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum

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