Received: from webgate.proteosys.de (mail.proteosys-ag.com [62.225.9.49]) by lucy.proteosys (8.11.0/8.9.3/SuSE Linux 8.9.3-0.1) with ESMTP id f19GjwH05166 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:45:58 +0100 Received: by webgate.proteosys.de (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f19Gjwd18413 . for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:45:58 +0100 Received: from mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailserver1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.30]) by mailgate2.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.11.0/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f19Gjq705252 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:45:57 +0100 (MET) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C092B7.C6E5E700" Received: from mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.56]) by mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA26713 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:45:52 +0100 (MET) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Received: from mail.listserv.gmd.de (mail.listserv.gmd.de [192.88.97.5]) by mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.11.0/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f19GjkM21466 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:45:46 +0100 (MET) Received: from mail.listserv.gmd.de (192.88.97.5) by mail.listserv.gmd.de (LSMTP for OpenVMS v1.1a) with SMTP id <5.94A80DBE@mail.listserv.gmd.de>; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:45:40 +0100 Received: from RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE by RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 1.8b) with spool id 488914 for LATEX-L@RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:45:43 +0100 Received: from ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (mail.urz.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.119.234]) by relay.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA23736 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:43:58 +0100 (MET) Received: from relay.uni-heidelberg.de (relay.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.100.212]) by ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA16076 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:43:58 +0100 Received: from zambeze.ujf-grenoble.fr (zambeze.ujf-grenoble.fr [152.77.2.3]) by relay.uni-heidelberg.de (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f19Ghwu29174 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:43:58 +0100 (MET) Received: from mozart.ujf-grenoble.Fr (mozart.ujf-grenoble.fr [193.54.241.5]) by zambeze.ujf-grenoble.fr (Pro-8.9.3/8.9.3/Configured by AD & JE 25/10/1999) with ESMTP id RAA22396 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:43:56 +0100 (MET) Received: (from bouche@localhost) by mozart.ujf-grenoble.Fr (8.9.3/8.8.5) id RAA23818; Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:43:56 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <200102091445.JAA00482@plmsc.psu.edu> References: <200102091445.JAA00482@plmsc.psu.edu> Return-Path: X-Mailer: VM 6.22 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: Re: inputenc text (and/or math) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 17:43:56 +0100 Message-ID: <200102091643.RAA23818@mozart.ujf-grenoble.Fr> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: From: "Thierry Bouche" Sender: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" To: "Multiple recipients of list LATEX-L" Reply-To: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 3781 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C092B7.C6E5E700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =BB If I understand it correctly, Tschichold recommentds only old-style =BB digits for text (he calls them text digits as different from titling =BB digits). Therefore I think that in the tradition of old school there =BB should be difference between '3's in the phrase =BB In Chapter~3 we will show that $\pi>3$. Nope. The really old tradition did know nothing about lining (also called "english" in France ;-) digits, anything used old style, which you still can see in the scan of a rather recent book by H.=A0Cartan I posted somewhere in page of the Latex navigator. There have been modern attempts to do what you're refering to. (I had a vote about the 3 possible styles, but I cannot make statistics about the voter's taste, as they were so few -- you can have a look at http://www-fourier.ujf-grenoble.fr/~bouche/tex/mathtests/OS-ornot-OS-e.ht= ml if you have some spare time to loose...) =BB Also, the command \MakeUppercase should take care of this =BB distinction, because old-style digits are actually *lowercase*, and =BB must be converted to upper case when, e.g. in running heads. yep. this is easily done by adding a family switch to \MakeUppercase. One more reason for a `case' axis in NFSS, but one more complexity (you would need families with varying letter-cases and fixed figures-cases + all other possibilities round...) =BB What do other people think of this? I think that you're point is one point in a myriad of possibilities. If you replace `must' by `could' in your discussion, I heartily agree with you, but notice that what you describe is easily done with current latex (redefine most \the, \MakeUpperLower-case, etc.) Thierry Bouche __ =AB Ils vivent pour vivre, et nous, h=E9las=A0! nous vivons pour = savoir. =BB Charles Baudelaire, Paris. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C092B7.C6E5E700 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: inputenc text (and/or math)

=BB If I understand it correctly, Tschichold = recommentds only old-style
=BB digits for text (he calls them text digits as = different from titling
=BB digits). Therefore I think that in the tradition = of old school there
=BB should be difference between '3's in the = phrase
=BB         = In Chapter~3 we will show that $\pi>3$.


Nope. The really old tradition did know nothing about = lining (also
called "english" in France ;-) digits, = anything used old style, which
you still can see in the scan of a rather recent book = by H.=A0Cartan
I posted somewhere in page of the Latex = navigator.

There have been modern attempts to do what you're = refering to. (I had
a vote about the 3 possible styles, but I cannot make = statistics about
the voter's taste, as they were so few -- you can = have a look at
http://www-fourier.ujf-grenoble.fr/~bouche/tex/mathtests/OS-o= rnot-OS-e.html
if you have some spare time to loose...)

=BB Also, the command \MakeUppercase should take care = of this
=BB distinction, because old-style digits are = actually *lowercase*, and
=BB must be converted to upper case when, e.g. in = running heads.

yep. this is easily done by adding a family switch = to
\MakeUppercase. One more reason for a `case' axis in = NFSS, but one
more complexity (you would need families with varying = letter-cases and
fixed figures-cases + all other possibilities = round...)

=BB What do other people think of this?

I think that you're point is one point in a myriad = of
possibilities. If you replace `must' by `could' in = your discussion, I
heartily agree with you, but notice that what you = describe is easily
done with current latex (redefine most \the, = \MakeUpperLower-case,
etc.)

Thierry Bouche
__
  =AB Ils vivent pour vivre, et nous, = h=E9las=A0! nous vivons pour savoir. =BB
          &nbs= p;            = ;         Charles Baudelaire, = Paris.

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