Received: from webgate.proteosys.de (mail.proteosys-ag.com [62.225.9.49]) by lucy.proteosys (8.11.0/8.9.3/SuSE Linux 8.9.3-0.1) with ESMTP id f16F7iH19092 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:44 +0100 Received: by webgate.proteosys.de (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f16F7hd05030 . for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C0904E.8E8FA000" Received: from mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailserver1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.30]) by mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.11.0/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f16F7hM04279 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:43 +0100 (MET) Received: from mailgate2.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailgate2.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.57]) by mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA21212 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:37 +0100 (MET) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Received: from mail.listserv.gmd.de (mail.listserv.gmd.de [192.88.97.5]) by mailgate2.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.11.0/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f16F7a712381 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:36 +0100 (MET) Received: from mail.listserv.gmd.de (192.88.97.5) by mail.listserv.gmd.de (LSMTP for OpenVMS v1.1a) with SMTP id <3.5F9A08B8@mail.listserv.gmd.de>; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:31 +0100 Received: from RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE by RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 1.8b) with spool id 488365 for LATEX-L@RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:33 +0100 Received: from ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (mail.urz.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.119.234]) by relay.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA07243 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:31 +0100 (MET) Received: from relay.uni-heidelberg.de (relay.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.100.212]) by ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA22976 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:32 +0100 Received: from nef.ens.fr (nef.ens.fr [129.199.96.32]) by relay.uni-heidelberg.de (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f16F7Vu07390 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:31 +0100 (MET) Received: from clipper.ens.fr (clipper-gw.ens.fr [129.199.1.22]) by nef.ens.fr (8.10.1/1.01.28121999) with ESMTP id f16F7U423344 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:30 +0100 (CET) Received: from (ebrunet@localhost) by clipper.ens.fr (8.9.2/jb-1.1) Return-Path: User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: Re: default inputenc/fontenc tight to language Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:07:29 +0100 Message-ID: <20010206160729.B14544@clipper.ens.fr> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: From: "Eric Brunet" Sender: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" To: "Multiple recipients of list LATEX-L" Reply-To: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 3719 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C0904E.8E8FA000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thierry Bouche wrote: > You mean that people with macintoshes should have something do declare > in their files and others not? And that this would be forced somewhere > in latex or babel kernel? Well, macintosh users have to declare something now, don't they ? And setting a default wouldn't change that; it is not as if a default would force macintosh users to have a preambule longer than what they now = have. It would be exactly the same thing. But if we declare a default, me = might shorten the preambule for all the macintosh users, or for all the unix plus all the windows users (thanks to the near compatibility of latin = and ansinew). So it is possible to make latex easier to a large majority without making it more difficult to the minority. I cannot see how this could be regarded as a bad solution ? > Well, if they have T1/fontenc, they won't see anything wrong. As long > as french is concerned, making latin1 the default is restrictive as T1 > is mandatory for correct hyphenation/kerning and T1 coincides with > latin1. You can live with only =AB =BB active with current latex, I = don't > see a good reason for requiring all >127 actives. So you suggest that unix (or windows) users should just declare \usepackage[T1]{fontenc} without declaring any inputenc package (relying on the fact that the T1 layout reproduce the latin1 layout), and that macintosh users should declare \usepackage[T1]{fontenc} and \usepackage[applemac]{inputenc} (because otherwise it would not work) ? Well, I propose exactly the same thing, except that with my proposal, = the characters above 127 would __moreover__ be correctly handled. =C9ric Brunet ------_=_NextPart_001_01C0904E.8E8FA000 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: default inputenc/fontenc tight to language

Thierry Bouche wrote:

> You mean that people with macintoshes should have = something do declare
> in their files and others not? And that this = would be forced somewhere
> in latex or babel kernel?

Well, macintosh users have to declare something now, = don't they ? And
setting a default wouldn't change that; it is not as = if a default would
force macintosh users to have a preambule longer than = what they now have.
It would be exactly the same thing. But if we declare = a default, me might
shorten the preambule for all the macintosh users, or = for all the unix
plus all the windows users (thanks to the near = compatibility of latin and
ansinew). So it is possible to make latex easier to a = large majority
without making it more difficult to the minority. I = cannot see how this
could be regarded as a bad solution ?

> Well, if they have T1/fontenc, they won't see = anything wrong. As long
> as french is concerned, making latin1 the = default is restrictive as T1
> is mandatory for correct hyphenation/kerning and = T1 coincides with
> latin1. You can live with only =AB =BB active = with current latex, I don't
> see a good reason for  requiring all = >127 actives.

So you suggest that unix (or windows) users should = just declare
\usepackage[T1]{fontenc} without declaring any = inputenc package (relying
on the fact that the T1 layout reproduce the latin1 = layout), and that
macintosh users should declare = \usepackage[T1]{fontenc} and
\usepackage[applemac]{inputenc} (because otherwise it = would not work) ?
Well, I propose exactly the same thing, except that = with my proposal, the
characters above 127 would __moreover__ be correctly = handled.

=C9ric Brunet

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