Received: from webgate.proteosys.de (mail.proteosys-ag.com [62.225.9.49]) by lucy.proteosys (8.11.0/8.9.3/SuSE Linux 8.9.3-0.1) with ESMTP id f0VLcf726860 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:41 +0100 Received: by webgate.proteosys.de (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0VLdU700701 . for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:39:30 +0100 Received: from mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailserver1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.30]) by mailgate2.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.11.0/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f0VLcb712489 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:37 +0100 (MET) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C08BCE.2D8B4680" Received: from mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.56]) by mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA05198 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:37 +0100 (MET) Received: from mail.listserv.gmd.de (mail.listserv.gmd.de [192.88.97.5]) by mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.11.0/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f0VLcaM05582 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:36 +0100 (MET) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Received: from mail.listserv.gmd.de (192.88.97.5) by mail.listserv.gmd.de (LSMTP for OpenVMS v1.1a) with SMTP id <10.013D58D1@mail.listserv.gmd.de>; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:33 +0100 Received: from RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE by RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 1.8b) with spool id 486422 for LATEX-L@RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:33 +0100 Received: from ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (mail.urz.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.119.234]) by relay.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA28724 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:31 +0100 (MET) Received: from relay.uni-heidelberg.de (relay.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.100.212]) by ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA17088 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:32 +0100 Received: from moutvdom00.kundenserver.de (moutvdom00.kundenserver.de [195.20.224.149]) by relay.uni-heidelberg.de (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) with ESMTP id f0VLcWp11819 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:32 +0100 (MET) Received: from [195.20.224.204] (helo=mrvdom00.kundenserver.de) by moutvdom00.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14O4xO-0003md-00 for LATEX-L@urz.uni-heidelberg.de; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:26 +0100 Received: from manz-3e36485f.pool.mediaways.net ([62.54.72.95] helo=istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de) by mrvdom00.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14O4x6-0002f7-00 for LATEX-L@URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:09 +0100 Received: (from latex3@localhost) by istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de (8.9.3/8.9.3/SuSE Linux 8.9.3-0.1) id WAA02948; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:36:06 +0100 In-Reply-To: References: <20010131103838.A5711@clipper.ens.fr> Return-Path: X-Mailer: VM 6.75 under Emacs 20.4.1 X-Authentication-Warning: istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de: latex3 set sender to frank@mittelbach-online.de using -f Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: Re: default inputenc/fontenc tight to language Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:36:06 +0100 Message-ID: <14968.34118.306909.315983@istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: From: "Frank Mittelbach" Sender: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" To: "Multiple recipients of list LATEX-L" Reply-To: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 3688 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C08BCE.2D8B4680 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > http://www.Uni-Mainz.DE/cgi-bin/ltxbugs2html?pr=3Dbabel/3046 Johannes talkes about the difficulties in providing this, but is it = really something one wants? - except when using mule (or emacs) one doesn't (automatically) change = input encodings when changing a language in the middle of the document. - beside, even if, for the same language many different input encodings = would be in use so you can't even pick a default without making a lot of = people unhappy. you can write german using cp437de or latin1 or ansinew or ... depending the OS used or the keyboard or ... - same is true for font encodings: my question about OT1 T1 showed that clearly, some people never use OT1 these days others only (and both = writing in the same language) i guess the only way to tie something like this to the language is as an offering, ie by default nothing is tied to a language but you have a = mechanism to say that all switches to language X result in switching the inputenc = to Y and give the user a chance to specify this in the preamble. and something similar for font encodings the problem with current babel is that for some language you have to do something and so it happens behind the scene but essentially it is not customiable (yet) and restoring state is not always as one would expect. frank ------_=_NextPart_001_01C08BCE.2D8B4680 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: default inputenc/fontenc tight to language

 > htt= p://www.Uni-Mainz.DE/cgi-bin/ltxbugs2html?pr=3Dbabel/3046

Johannes talkes about the difficulties in providing = this, but is it really
something one wants?

 - except when using mule (or emacs) one doesn't = (automatically) change input
   encodings when
   changing a language in the middle of the = document.

 - beside, even if, for the same language many = different input encodings would
   be in use so you can't even pick a = default without making a lot of people
   unhappy. you can write german using = cp437de or latin1 or ansinew or
   ... depending the OS used or the = keyboard or ...

 - same is true for font encodings: my question = about OT1 T1 showed that
   clearly, some people never use OT1 these = days others only (and both writing
   in the same language)

i guess the only way to tie something like this to the = language is as an
offering, ie by default nothing is tied to a language = but you have a mechanism
to say that all switches to language X result in = switching the inputenc to Y
and give the user a chance to specify this in the = preamble.

and something similar for font encodings

the problem with current babel is that for some = language you have to do
something and so it happens behind the scene but = essentially it is not
customiable (yet) and restoring state is not always = as one would expect.

frank

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