Received: via tmail-4.1(11) (invoked by user schoepf) for schoepf; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:10:19 +0100 (MET) Received: from mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.56]) by mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA03930 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:10:18 +0100 (MET) Received: from mail.listserv.gmd.de (mail.listserv.gmd.de [192.88.97.5]) by mailgate1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA11265 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:10:18 +0100 (MET) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01BF87C1.23E03F80" Received: from mail.listserv.gmd.de (192.88.97.5) by mail.listserv.gmd.de (LSMTP for OpenVMS v1.1a) with SMTP id <8.CCEA9C61@mail.listserv.gmd.de>; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 0:08:59 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Received: from RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE by RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 1.8b) with spool id 451686 for LATEX-L@RELAY.URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:03:46 +0100 Received: from ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (mail.urz.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.119.234]) by relay.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA15682 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:03:45 +0100 (MET) Received: from relay.uni-heidelberg.de (relay.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.100.212]) by ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA13906 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:06:22 +0100 Received: from mailgate2.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailgate2.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.57]) by relay.uni-heidelberg.de (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA15829 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:03:46 +0100 (MET) Received: from mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (mailserver1.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.8.30]) by mailgate2.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA08537 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:06:23 +0100 (MET) Received: from istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de (root@dialin31.zdv.Uni-Mainz.DE [134.93.174.31]) by mail.Uni-Mainz.DE (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA02675 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:06:21 +0100 (MET) Received: (from design@localhost) by istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) id AAA02162; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:06:53 +0100 In-Reply-To: References: <200003052035.VAA01735@kammer.uni-hannover.de> Return-Path: x-vm-v5-data: ([nil nil nil nil nil nil nil nil nil]["3014" "Tue" "7" "March" "2000" "00:06:53" "+0100" "Frank Mittelbach" "frank.mittelbach@LATEX-PROJECT.ORG" nil "71" "on OR and trace" "^Date:" nil nil "3" nil "on OR and trace" nil nil nil]nil) X-Authentication-Warning: istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de: design set sender to design@istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de using -f Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: on OR and trace Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 00:06:53 +0100 Message-ID: <200003062306.AAA02162@istrati.zdv.uni-mainz.de> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: From: "Frank Mittelbach" Sender: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" To: "Multiple recipients of list LATEX-L" Reply-To: "Mailing list for the LaTeX3 project" Status: R X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 3545 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01BF87C1.23E03F80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Lars wrote, > At 21.35 +0100 2000-03-05, Reinhard Kotucha wrote: > >Hi, > >unfortunately Frank told us in his last mail that he vanishes for a > >few days to work on output routines. > > I wonder when he will appear again? It's been a month. OTOH, output > routines are tricky things, so it is hardly surprising that it takes = time. here he is but he is going to vanish again in a few minutes :-) have to do preparations for the DANTE meeting where i like to show some = of the new stuff yes output routines are tricky beasts but the work we did last mont was = well spend, i think. i hope to be able to present parts of it real soon on = this list on the www server. so much for now: - the pages produced from the new OR are looking horrible :-) and it is slower and can't do a lot the old could - but we are really feeling good about it as it has the potential and it is getting there. what it can right now is - doing multiple columns (up to 6 right now but this is not a = restriction) - handle different float strategies, eg float after callout, float = after or on the same column, float on the same page - deal with bottom floats when footnotes are involved (disallow them, = decide where the footnote goes ... - allow absolute manual control if needed. ie writes a float position = file and all you have to do is to move lines in that file to move floats = around. - allows for \flushfloat which outputs all floats before the current = point without starting a new page - allows for caption positioning depending on placement - allows for changing the position algorithm - will soon handle page spreads (essentially considering a spread as a multicolumn situation) - will soon do spanning floats - will (hopefully) soon do marginal floats right now it is roughly 40 pages code and growing (and buggy :-) but ... as for the page hook. somethig like that should be definitely become = part of that OR. > PS: When I wrote about tracefnt anyway, I might as well mension this = thing > too. Could it be possible to have the option reinserted that = temporarily > resetted the \tracing... parameters during \selectfont? Appearently = this > feature was bundled with something else that probably doesn't work = anymore, > but I can't see any reason (apart from lack of time) why it shouldn't = be > possible to reinsert just this particular feature. I'm so tired of = wading > through screenful after screenful of font selection every time I need = to > trace a piece of code that, apart from the things I'm really = interested in, > also does a couple of font changes. wish granted. in fact while working on the OR and other things i got so = tired of such output that i wrote a small little package called trace that implements that kind of stuff. putting it into tracfnt is not a good = idea as there is more than just font stuff one wants to disable. it is right now in Barbara Beeton's hand as a submission for TUB and i'm = going to put it onto the WWW in a few days. good night frank ------_=_NextPart_001_01BF87C1.23E03F80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable on OR and trace

Lars wrote,

 > At 21.35 +0100 2000-03-05, Reinhard Kotucha = wrote:
 > >Hi,
 > >unfortunately Frank told us in his = last mail that he vanishes for a
 > >few days to work on output = routines.
 >
 > I wonder when he will appear again? It's = been a month. OTOH, output
 > routines are tricky things, so it is = hardly surprising that it takes time.

here he is but he is going to vanish again in a few = minutes :-)

have to do preparations for the DANTE meeting where i = like to show some of the
new stuff

yes output routines are tricky beasts but the work we = did last mont was well
spend, i think. i hope to be able to present parts of = it real soon on this
list on the www server.

so much for now:

 - the pages produced from the new OR are looking = horrible :-)
   and it is slower and can't do a lot the = old could
 - but we are really feeling good about it as it = has the potential
   and it is getting there.

what it can right now is

 - doing multiple columns (up to 6 right now but = this is not a restriction)
 - handle different float strategies, eg float = after callout, float after or
   on the same column, float on the same = page
 - deal with bottom floats  when footnotes = are involved (disallow them, decide
   where the footnote goes ...
 - allow absolute manual control if needed. ie = writes a float position file
   and all you have to do is to move lines = in that file to move floats around.
 - allows for \flushfloat which outputs all = floats before the current point
   without starting a new page
 - allows for caption positioning depending on = placement
 - allows for changing the position = algorithm

 - will soon handle page spreads (essentially = considering a spread as a
   multicolumn situation)
 - will soon do spanning floats
 - will (hopefully) soon do marginal = floats

right now it is roughly 40 pages code and growing (and = buggy :-)
but ...

as for the page hook. somethig like that should be = definitely become part of
that OR.

 > PS: When I wrote about tracefnt anyway, I = might as well mension this thing
 > too. Could it be possible to have the = option reinserted that temporarily
 > resetted the \tracing... parameters during = \selectfont? Appearently this
 > feature was bundled with something else = that probably doesn't work anymore,
 > but I can't see any reason (apart from = lack of time) why it shouldn't be
 > possible to reinsert just this particular = feature. I'm so tired of wading
 > through screenful after screenful of font = selection every time I need to
 > trace a piece of code that, apart from the = things I'm really interested in,
 > also does a couple of font changes.

wish granted. in fact while working on the OR and = other things i got so tired
of such output that i wrote a small little package = called trace that
implements that kind of stuff. putting it into = tracfnt is not a good idea as
there is more than just font stuff one wants to = disable.

it is right now in Barbara Beeton's hand as a = submission for TUB and i'm going
to put it onto the WWW in a few days.

good night
frank

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